Another new course suggestion -- Ear Training For Guitarists

[pfizer]

Hey guys, I just had a new idea for a course which would deal with ear training as it applies to the guitar.

I've seen many other ear training books out there but most of them are pretty vague when it comes to application since they have to write the book as broadly as they can, so that every instrument can be utilized. As a guitar player, I'm beginning to see that I really am a pretty terrible musician. I've found that most guitarists rely more on the visual and physical aspect when it comes to playing, since they rely on the scale patterns and muscle memory.

I've known guitar players with a well trained ear and my experience with them have been eye-opening and downright humbling at times. One of them is a self-confessed 'sloppy' player but he's the main composer and transcriber for his band, simply because his ears are well trained. He teachers the guitar parts to the other player in the band without needing tabs but just from pure memory. I've also known a technically proficient guitarist who had ear training at Berklee and while he admits he doesn't know a lot of songs, he needs only to listen to a song three times before he can play it well-enough to perform.

That said, I would love for TF to develop a course that not only shows the basics of ear training but also provides an effective way to practice it. I've heard that Berklee uses a 'movable-do' system of ear training and I would very much like to see it refined into a course by TF.

Thanks for reading guys, and please comment about what you think!

[Johnny]

That's a great idea pfizer

[Leedelta]

This subject has popped up a few times on the forum over the years.

I study ear training pretty regularly and it is a great tool.

Interval Insights is a good course to discover intervals and get the sounds into your head.

[Jestme]

I like the 'sound' of that.

[pfizer]

This subject has popped up a few times on the forum over the years.

I study ear training pretty regularly and it is a great tool.

Interval Insights is a good course to discover intervals and get the sounds into your head.

I've actually already seen the Interval Insights course and while it's very good, it's a bit too advanced and concise for me and it also doesn't provide any practical way to practice what is taught. I've heard that the way to practice ear training is to have another person play the notes while the other person says it out loud.

I'd prefer for an ear-training course to start with the very basics and go all the way to intermediate or even early advanced.

[beboy]

Edit: I was wrong when I posted this. I got my memories mixed up. However, Bruce does sell an ear training books thru his website. http://www.muse-eek.com/books/books.html
Scroll down to Books for Ear Training.
There was a rumor a while back (maybe 9 months ago) that Bruce Arnold "might" be working on a Ear Training course for TrueFire.

[pfizer]

There was a rumor a while back (maybe 9 months ago) that Bruce Arnold "might" be working on a Ear Training course for TrueFire.

Any news on it since then? And is there a chance we can let the big guys know that we do *still* want an ear-training course?

I'm really hoping they make it so that it incorporates the shapes and scales with the ear-training in a practical way. Like I said, most ear-training courses I've looked at really try to appeal to wider range of instrumentalists so a lot of guitar players just give up and stick with their grips and patterns without actually knowing the music.

Ear training is probably one of the hardest things to practice by yourself and I'm really hoping TF makes this one.

[Goerman]

Pfizer,

I think this is a much over looked topic. As musicians we all have to be good listeners on so many different levels. Personally I have neglected giving specific ear training a place on my practice regimen. I recently purchased Ear Master and try to get in 10 -15 minutes each and everyday. I will tell you it is already paying off. As good as the course is however, it doesn't really tell you how to practice. Having said that getting a relative sense of pitch developed is pretty straight forward. Starting with identifying intervals is definetly the jumping off point.

[pfizer]

Pfizer,

I think this is a much over looked topic. As musicians we all have to be good listeners on so many different levels. Personally I have neglected giving specific ear training a place on my practice regimen. I recently purchased Ear Master and try to get in 10 -15 minutes each and everyday. I will tell you it is already paying off. As good as the course is however, it doesn't really tell you how to practice. Having said that getting a relative sense of pitch developed is pretty straight forward. Starting with identifying intervals is definetly the jumping off point.

Yeah, one of the hardest things to do with ear training is actually practicing it without cheating or losing motivation. That's why with regards to a TrueFire ear training course, I'd like for a practice tool of some sort included, in the same vein as rhythm tracks are for the other courses. Give us different levels of songs, from easy-to-figure-out beginner tracks to multi-modal advanced tracks, that we can use to train our ears.

I've already spent a little over $100 on ear training and "perfect pitch/relative pitch" course books and audio CDs, but again, they're aimed a bit too broadly I think. Most of them use the piano as a way of ear training and I can't really blame them for that since the piano is a tad easier to learn theory on than on the guitar.

What I want for TF to do is make an ear training course that is as much visual as it is aural; I want them to incorporate the visual nature of the guitar's scales, patterns and grips, into sound. The end result should be that the player will see a scale, chord or grip and know exactly how it should sound before even playing it.

[Leedelta]

Pfizer: Use the relative pitch courses that you bought to figure out the intervals on the strings of the guitar.

Then when you see diads and triads in tab you will begin to recognise the "grips"

[pfizer]

Pfizer: Use the relative pitch courses that you bought to figure out the intervals on the strings of the guitar.

Then when you see diads and triads in tab you will begin to recognise the "grips"

I *have* done that in the past and I did see some minimal improvement with my ability to listen by ear but since I'm a full-time student, I really couldn't maintain the pace I was going at and ended up back where I started.

The great thing about TF courses is that they sort of provide me with a curriculum that I can work my schedule around -- for example, I borrowed a copy of 40-Day Swat Rhythm and 3D Acoustic Guitar from a friend and they both have a well defined course outline that I can take in small chunks as my schedule allows.

Again, this is more of my problem regarding ear-training in that the resources I have are cluttered & messy, and I don't know how to practice them.

[Rgalvez]

In the meantime check out this cool article from Guitarnoise:

http://www.guitarnoise.com/lesson/happy-new-ear/

[pfizer]

Great find on that article rgalvez I'll try those methods when I get some time for myself.

I'm still hoping for TF to make a complete ear-training course, mostly because the guys here have a way of making something that's very intimidating and complicated-sounding into something that's accessible and easy to understand.

3D Acoustic Guitar and Fingerstyle Blues Handbook are good examples of this because I've never ever thought I'd be able to play fingerstyle and percussive guitar but I can do both now with some level of proficiency. I'm hoping they can apply the same magic with ear-training which still frankly confuses and frustrates the hell out of me to this very day.

[Leedelta]

I *have* done that in the past and I did see some minimal improvement with my ability to listen by ear but since I'm a full-time student, I really couldn't maintain the pace I was going at and ended up back where I started.

.

Try 10 mins in the morning after breakfast and 10 mins before bed.

Start on perfect 5ths on 2 strings, sing them and name the notes, go back and forth between the notes, then chromatically go as far as you can sing.

Then a few days later move to Perfect 4ths, Then Maj3, Min3.

After a few weeks try Major Chords,Minor Chords, then Inversions etc

I think jimiclaptoncarl turned onto these

http://www.iwasdoingallright.com/ear-training/

http://www.iwasdoingallright.com/jazz_blog/166/

[Goerman]

Good input as usual Leedelta,

I think the daily bit (even 10 minutes) is uber important. Take the time to actually sing the major scale and then the various intervals. This becomes your reference point for everything. For the record I don't sing (but I'm working on it). Probably the best ear training exercise for guitar which is simple and there for all of us is to tune your guitar BY EAR - everyday. Tune one reference note with a tuner (or better yet with a tuning fork or other instrument you know is in tune) and then go from there, using your ear only. Check your work with a tuner and make note of where you are falling short.

[jimiclaptoncarl]

Here ya' go pfizer, this should hold you over until TF gets an ear course going!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-AcbqrULL0

[herby]

Can't get enough ear training.

[gadlaw]

Here ya' go pfizer, this should hold you over until TF gets an ear course going!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-AcbqrULL0

That guy is pretty good, reminds me of Antonio Banderas. Perhaps one of the future TrueFire future Spanish speaking instructors - I mean his video you linked to was close captioned in Spanish.

[pfizer]

With the influx of new excellent courses here at TF, I just wanted to thump the Ear Training drum a little bit.

Please make an Ear Training Course TF!

I've noticed that most ear training instructions really only teach patterns that sound pleasant to the ear; there's nothing wrong with that because that's how our brains work. I'd like for TF to make something that covers it comprehensively, even the sounds that sound unpleasant or dissonant when out of context.

I guess I'm pretty much alone in wanting a course like this, along with anything resembling a rock/metal, but I don't care. I love guitar playing too much and it's become my proverbial crutch to cope. I don't really know anything else and even if I'm not very good, even by garage band standards, I still strive to make myself better and TF, along with everyone in the boards, has helped me achieve some measure of that.

[bcraig]

Yes I agree that would be awesome if you could make this course in such a way where having fun and play muisc but there's ear training pack in there
just a thought.
Bc

[Leedelta]

With the influx of new excellent courses here at TF, I just wanted to thump the Ear Training drum a little bit.

Please make an Ear Training Course TF!

I've noticed that most ear training instructions really only teach patterns that sound pleasant to the ear; there's nothing wrong with that because that's how our brains work. I'd like for TF to make something that covers it comprehensively, even the sounds that sound unpleasant or dissonant when out of context.

I guess I'm pretty much alone in wanting a course like this, along with anything resembling a rock/metal, but I don't care. I love guitar playing too much and it's become my proverbial crutch to cope. I don't really know anything else and even if I'm not very good, even by garage band standards, I still strive to make myself better and TF, along with everyone in the boards, has helped me achieve some measure of that.

Don't worry you are not alone in wanting an ear training course, but sometimes it takes a while for courses to be prepared.

[wvgman]

So far all I can get my ears to do is hang on the side of my head and hold up a pair of sunglasses. I knew a guy back in grade school who could make his ears wiggle, but mine just don't seem to be able to handle that trick.

[docbop]

Piano as a second instrument. I guess the old term was "arrangers piano", but cover basics to help in ear training, practicing improv, composition. Enough piano to play some chords, melodies, and scales.

[bcraig]

I have a to agree with this I really think Ture Fire need to make a really great ear training course for all of us and future musician please
Bcraig

[gadlaw]

I have a to agree with this I really think Ture Fire need to make a really great ear training course for all of us and future musician please
Bcraig

Who do you think should do that course and what would such a course look like?

[bcraig]

gadlaw I been look and search around the net for that very thing on ear training.Aslo along with stuff on really super basic rythms i
Now very soon here I want to do two blog on bcraig Rythm Blog and bcraig Ear Traing Blog both of these to help newbies like me and to help better myself so I can go from newbie to more complex. etc ... by feed and learn off others.
also would like to start another blog on ear training.For the same idea and reasons
But i am still in the progess try to gather information that can give TF or any buddy eslse an ideas.
So i am working on it i think it is vital to any one trying to presue music as hobbly or as profession.I beleive we need to learn how to develop that inner part of of our ear so we can play first what we hear in our head without haveing to stop playing guitar and then try to search around the freeboard trying to identified those tones that make up that lick, that muiscal phrase or any meoldy or even
rythm etc...

Bcraig

[herby]

bcraig, until we see a course on ear training, this tip might help: Play each note of a chromatic scale individually and relate it back to the tonic one note at a time. Tonic to a note and back to the tonic. Try and think of a familiar song that begins with that interval. For example:
tonic to a half step above, or flatted 2nd = "Theme from Jaws"
tonic to the perfect 4th: "Theme from Exodus"

Etc. You can fill whatever songs you want to any and all of the other intervals and it will help you remember them.

[Leedelta]

Hang onto your muffins folks...

Rumor has it, that Bruce Arnold is cooking up an ear training TF course. I have seen some test clips.

No release date yey but it looks to be pretty indepth.

I am against using musical crutches such as theme tunes. One of the best tricks I use is playing an interval (say 5th) on the guitar and singing it back and forth (A-E, R-5, E-A,5-R), then move chromatically up/down the neck.

It instills the interval and also teaches you music theory.

[bcraig]

Leedelta thanks for the heads up again sound good
herby thanks for your input
I have been doing that with the major scale
Using the C Maj to keep these easy at first
So C D is a Maj 2nd the song = happy birthday
C E Maj 3rd = when the saint go marching on
C F Perfect 4 th = here comes the bride
C G Perfect 5 th = starwars theme
C A Maj 6 th = my bonnie lies over the ocean

C B Maj 7 th = no song for this I does know it is a leading tone back to the root which in this case is C Maj

C C Octve = some where over the rainbow

This I have been working on guitar and keyboard

[wvgman]

I like what you just did there, bcraig! I can hear those songs start when I use those intervals. I like that! Very helpful!

[herby]

Good job and some good choices there bcraig. Now on to the minor scale! lol

[Leedelta]

Leedelta thanks for the heads up again sound good
herby thanks for your input
I have been doing that with the major scale
Using the C Maj to keep these easy at first
So C D is a Maj 2nd the song = happy birthday
C E Maj 3rd = when the saint go marching on
C F Perfect 4 th = here comes the bride
C G Perfect 5 th = starwars theme
C A Maj 6 th = my bonnie lies over the ocean

C B Maj 7 th = no song for this I does know it is a leading tone back to the root which in this case is C Maj

C C Octve = some where over the rainbow

This I have been working on guitar and keyboard

Octave and Mjr 7...Doctor Who theme C-C-B..then 9th and 2nd inversion G chord...

[Ravi TheRaviator]

Hi All,

I have a new course coming out very soon...it's all about chord progressions and how to identify the standard and repeated patterns that songwriters use. This not only empowers the player to anticipate changes and the songwriter to learn tried and true writing techniques, but also develops the ear to recognize chord changes without an instrument in hand...as you can imagine, this is not only practical (one can learn songs in the car on the way to a gig!), but a really useful skill in terms of learning songs by ear. Since it is done using examples of many songs that share the same progressions, it is really a fun way to learn a lot of songs while training the ear and learning the secrets behind the craft of songwriting. Keep an eye out for it...coming soon to a browser near you!

Best, Ravi

[robzebr]

http://www.discount.perfectpitch.com/coursecontent.htm

[pfizer]

Hey guys, Daniel here

It's 2012 and I still want that Ear Training course TF's been pretty busy lately developing a ton of different courses for Blues (seriously, Voodoo Blues, Progressive Blues, Eclectic Blues, SWAT Blues...) Jazz (two Vignola courses), fingerstyle (Tommy Emmanuel, Vicki Genfan and Joe Dalton are truly awesome ) and even that long begged for classical/flamenco course (New World Flamenco by Tierra Negra). There even expansion into other instruments like bass, dobro, banjo and harmonica (totally getting Blues Harmonica Blueprint).

And here I am, still waiting and still wanting that definitive Ear Training for Guitarists course. Hope others here do too.

Make it happen Truefire! You guys haven't let us down yet!

[Ravi (Guitar Sherpa)]

Hi Daniel,

It may not be exactly what you are looking for, but my 30 Rock and Pop Progressions is designed as an ear training course (as well as a theory and primer for songwriting course). The idea behind associating common chord progressions with a variety of well know songs naturally trains your ear to recognize harmonic relationships. So, it's really useful for the person with ideas in his head (or wants to generate ideas) that need to be translated to his instrument, but also for the person who wants to hear a chord progression, recognize it quickly, and play it...ideal for the guy in a cover band in that sense, or anyone "sitting in" with a band and trying to catch on. Check it out, and let me know if you have any questions.

Best, Ravi

Hey guys, Daniel here

It's 2012 and I still want that Ear Training course TF's been pretty busy lately developing a ton of different courses for Blues (seriously, Voodoo Blues, Progressive Blues, Eclectic Blues, SWAT Blues...) Jazz (two Vignola courses), fingerstyle (Tommy Emmanuel, Vicki Genfan and Joe Dalton are truly awesome ) and even that long begged for classical/flamenco course (New World Flamenco by Tierra Negra). There even expansion into other instruments like bass, dobro, banjo and harmonica (totally getting Blues Harmonica Blueprint).

And here I am, still waiting and still wanting that definitive Ear Training for Guitarists course. Hope others here do too.

Make it happen Truefire! You guys haven't let us down yet!

[pfizer]

Hey there Ravi, took a look at your course and it looks pretty neat! Guess I'll have to add it to my list then... Thanks a lot for the response!